Euskal Oiloa Chicken Forum

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#1 2013-07-01 21:59:00

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Need help with a gorria SOP

I have registered 5 EOs at a lawn show happening July 13th in Red Deer. 1 marraduna cock (or possibly cockerel, I need to decide next weekend), 2 marraduna pullets and 2 gorria pullets.

I was reviewing our SOP, planning to send it to the judge, and just recalled we have nothing written on the gorria variety.

I thought it would be simple to add, red and black how hard can it be? But i am finding it more difficult than expected. Where exactly should they be black, black and red, red and orangy red?

Most interesting I can't find another breed in the American SOP with the same color. None seem to have black on the wings in the same way. Can anyone suggest a breed described in the SOP with the same feather color pattern?

I may resort to bringing pictures to show proper feather color if I can't get this sorted out...aren't pictures supposed to be worth a thousand words?


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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2013-07-01 21:59:00

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#2 2013-07-01 22:48:35

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Re: Need help with a gorria SOP

Here is a draft, same formate as the breed and marraduna SOPs.

GORRIA BASQUE

DISQUALIFICATIONS 
Entirely white feathers in the sickle or main tail feathers. Entirely white feathers in the the primary or secondary wing feathers.

COLOR-MALE

COMB, FACE, WATTLES AND EAR-LOBES:  Bright red.
BEAK:  Yellow.
EYES:  Chestnut.
HEAD:  Red.
NECK:  Hackle red shading at the base to a lighter red. A narrow black stripe extending down the middle of each feather. Front of neck same as breast.
BACK: Red in upper parts shading to lighter red in the lower saddle.
TAIL:  Main tail black. Sickles lustrous greenish black. Coverts black gradually turning to red approaching the saddle.
WINGS:  Front, bows, and coverts red. Primaries black then upper edge red. Primary coverts black edged with red.
BREAST:  Red.
BODY AND FLUFF:  Red similar to the breast. Fluff ivory.
LEGS AND TOES:  Lower thighs red. Shanks and toes yellow.
UNDERCOLOR OF ALL SECTIONS:  Ivory

COLOR-FEMALE
COMB, FACE, WATTLES AND EAR-LOBES:  Bright red.
BEAK:  Yellow.
EYES:  Chestnut.
HEAD:  Red.
NECK:  Red. Lower neck feathers with a black stripe down the middle of each feather. Front of neck similar to breast. 
BACK:  Red.
TAIL:  Main tail black edged with red. Shaft red.
WINGS:  Front, bar and secondaries and bows red. Primaries red with lower web of first few primary feathers black transitioning to red. Primary coverts black edged with red. When the wing is folded in the natural position only the red color shows.
BREAST:  Red.
BODY AND FLUFF:  Red. Fluff ivory.
LEGS AND TOES:  Lower thighs red. Shanks and toes yellow.
UNDERCOLOR OF ALL SECTIONS:  Ivory

Have we decided on what color the eyes should be? Brown was the original, chestnut may be a better descriptor.
And what about the number or points on the comb: 5, 6 or 7?
I think those are survey questions for this fall so may need to remain undecided for now.
In the mean time I am thinking to use "chestnut" for now and 6 points if that's ok?


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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#3 2013-07-01 23:57:38

gubi
Member
From: Walton
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 1344
Website

Re: Need help with a gorria SOP

I don't own a standard but how about the New Hampshires or red sussex?


Herd of Brown Swiss, a few sheep, red cuckoo basque, Silverspangled Appenzeller Spitzhauben, ameraucanas(EE), Welsummer, broodie silkies and a few more heritage hens

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#4 2013-07-02 02:40:09

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Re: Need help with a gorria SOP

No picture of the Red Sussex but the description is there and seems fairly close. New Hampshires tHere is also a painting.. I don't think the black on the wing of either bred is visible when they are closed. I think on a male EO the black should be visible?


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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#5 2013-07-02 03:15:32

Micah and Kiah
Member
From: West Grey
Registered: 2012-04-20
Posts: 839

Re: Need help with a gorria SOP

poplar girl wrote:

No picture of the Red Sussex but the description is there and seems fairly close. New Hampshires tHere is also a painting.. I don't think the black on the wing of either bred is visible when they are closed. I think on a male EO the black should be visible?

I hope this website link to Red Sussex works!

http://www.euskalabereak.net/detalle.aspx?Id=43

https://www.google.ca/url?sa=i&rct= … 0539337041


http://www.infoagroisp.com/infocarne/av … oiloa2.jpg


All the best,

Kiah and Micah

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#6 2013-07-02 11:12:02

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Re: Need help with a gorria SOP

Thanks M&K.

I see the wing seems to be a deeper red than the body, and the hackles and saddle lighter. I described the hackle and lower saddle as lighter, maybe I should say "orangey red" instead of "lighter red"? Would you call parts of the wing darker red than the body?

There does also seem to be more black on the wing of the coks showing when its closed than other breeds.

Also I see the beak on many is yellow but tinted with a darker color (other breeds say tinted with redish horn). I noted in one Spanish description I translated that it seems to say that instead of just saying "beak yellow". Should we describe the color as "yellow" or "yellow tinting to redish horn".


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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#7 2013-07-02 15:27:51

Micah and Kiah
Member
From: West Grey
Registered: 2012-04-20
Posts: 839

Re: Need help with a gorria SOP

Deep yellow legs
yellow tinting to reddish horn is a perfect description
the hackles become almost iridescent, fiery glow maybe a yellow-red? 
The shade deepens in the wings of the males, stippled with black 
Black in the tail feathers... how would you describe it, flecked, tipped, laced... I can't find the right word, sorry


Let me know what else might help.

poplar girl wrote:

Thanks M&K.

I see the wing seems to be a deeper red than the body, and the hackles and saddle lighter. I described the hackle and lower saddle as lighter, maybe I should say "orangey red" instead of "lighter red"? Would you call parts of the wing darker red than the body?

There does also seem to be more black on the wing of the coks showing when its closed than other breeds.

Also I see the beak on many is yellow but tinted with a darker color (other breeds say tinted with redish horn). I noted in one Spanish description I translated that it seems to say that instead of just saying "beak yellow". Should we describe the color as "yellow" or "yellow tinting to redish horn".


All the best,

Kiah and Micah

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#8 2013-07-02 17:25:49

Little Boy Blue
Member
From: Marble Falls, Texas
Registered: 2012-07-11
Posts: 83
Website

Re: Need help with a gorria SOP

I am guilty in that I don't have a copy of the APA book yet either, but the APA judge that advised the standards committee for the Cream Legbar told us that we were wasting our time if we didn't have at least one person on the committee with the APA book.  He said that we have to read the first 36 pages (count?) or else our standard would turn out to be a blue sock to black sock comparison. The terms for describing chicks are in the APA book so ussing those terms is required for a proposed SOP to be accpeted.  I am not sure how orange, red, orangy red, etc. are defined in the book, but you might check to see who the APA judges are who are going to be at the show you are attending and see it they would be willing to advize ont he Marraduna Standard if an APA judge hasn't done that yet as well as advice on the Glorria standard.  APA's requirments are really limiting.  The Poultry Club of Great Britian allowed 5-7 points on teh comb for their standard, cream, perle or white ear lobes, yellow or willow legs, etc.  APA only would allow a us to define 6 points and 5 points or 7 points was a 1/2 point deduction, they made us choose one ear lobe color and the others were point deductions, they made us choose one leg color and the others were deductions.   They were also realy harch on making sure that we were not simply describing what we currently had, but what the breed was supposed to be.  IF we have orangy-red glorrias and they should be the color of a New Hampshire the standard should be the same as the New Hamprise color and the orangy red from the Marraduna line should be breed out (Just and example). 

Yes, writting Standard is a very involved process.  I though translating the standard from one language to the other should be a faily quick process (especial the Cream Legbar since it was from English to English),  but it took dozens of people 4-5 months time to complete.

If you want any help with interpretations of translations I will help.  I do have a college degree in Spanish.  I also have learned a little by contributing to this process once before.  I do not have a good handle on the colors or shapes of the EO's though.  I have gone through all the threads with the photos and discussion on this thread, but when I see photos of birds in Spain, Europe, North America, historic, present day, etc. and try to come to a conclusion of what I am supposed to be breeding to I don't see a lot of consiste3ncy and mostly just select for what I like.

I think that ussing the New Hampshire APA Standard for color and going from there is the best way to go.


Cottage Hill Black Copper Marans & Cream Legbars

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#9 2013-07-02 22:57:53

Maggiesdad
Moderator
From: Louisa County, Virginia
Registered: 2011-10-05
Posts: 1980

Re: Need help with a gorria SOP

Sent you an email, LBB...

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#10 2013-07-17 21:58:00

Little Boy Blue
Member
From: Marble Falls, Texas
Registered: 2012-07-11
Posts: 83
Website

Re: Need help with a gorria SOP

Yep...I got the PM. Sorry for the slow response.  I was out of pocket from the 3rd-14th and am now playig catch-up.


Cottage Hill Black Copper Marans & Cream Legbars

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