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#1 2013-04-12 13:27:44

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

How to get Beltza

As much as I am not completely clueless in genetics I am having trouble figuring out how (or if) i can work towards the beltza variety of EO.

I know the beltza variety has an Extended black e-allele instead of wheaten which may be missing in our North American EO population. I also know it is unbarred, I have unbarred (gorria) EOs I can remove the barring with. But how to get to black and remove the gold and red?

Here is a rooster I gave to a friend last fall. I have purposed the idea to her of trying to use him to breed for beltza using some of the grey marraduna and/or gorria hens.

I played in the online chicken color calculator this morning and I can't replicate his color pattern. I do have a Genetics of Chicken Colour book yet to review but I thought I'd post some pictures and see if anyone has ideas.

http://i905.photobucket.com/albums/ac252/sulzmi/Euskal%20oiloa/8614bdecee99c9bec740d8d50d40e467.jpg

What do you think? Does he have potential for a breeder for beltza? I don't recall any chicks with really strange chick down color last spring so I think I would still need to outcross with a black breed. If so how would I get there?

Perhaps that's a bigger project than I'm willing to take on right now but it would be nice to know how it could be done.


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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2013-04-12 13:27:44

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#2 2013-04-12 13:31:48

Flat Rock Farm
Member
From: Branchton, Ontario Canada
Registered: 2011-07-03
Posts: 3359

Re: How to get Beltza

I can't help you with any of your question PG, but all I can say is what a handsome fellow :love:

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#3 2013-04-12 18:48:15

yardbirds
Member
From: just north of Yorkton, Sk.
Registered: 2012-07-09
Posts: 334

Re: How to get Beltza

:shock:  He is a stunning roo.... :love:  That's the clincher.... I NEED EO'S     N O W   ! ! !


urban flock consisting two EOs thx Prairie Chick, one True Blue Ameraucana, and two Welsummers, thx Dan Smith and a gorgeous Easter Egger Hen, thx Flicker Chick. and 2 GLW pullets, 1 GLW cockerel, 1 SLW cockerel, 1 true blue Ameraucana pullet, and 4 EE pullets and 1 Cream Brabanter pullet, Thx to FRF, Anneke, and Fallyn.

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#4 2013-04-12 20:13:15

Maggiesdad
Moderator
From: Louisa County, Virginia
Registered: 2011-10-05
Posts: 1980

Re: How to get Beltza

That is one cool looking dude! :applause:

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#5 2013-04-12 23:43:55

Micah and Kiah
Member
From: West Grey
Registered: 2012-04-20
Posts: 839

Re: How to get Beltza

Gosh I wish my memory was better.  Who was it who showed us pictures of their handsome EO cockeral that had black and dark gray and little to no barring?


All the best,

Kiah and Micah

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#6 2013-04-13 00:18:30

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Re: How to get Beltza

I think it was Chrish M&K.

Not sure if I will have the opportunity for this project but he is a handsome boy isn't he.


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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#7 2013-04-13 01:18:51

Micah and Kiah
Member
From: West Grey
Registered: 2012-04-20
Posts: 839

Re: How to get Beltza

He's heterogeneous for barring, right?  What if some of the the lady Greys and their male counter parts with very little barring, would that work?  Three EO colours here already!


All the best,

Kiah and Micah

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#8 2013-04-13 23:56:00

riverbendfarm
Member
From: Baker Settlement, Nova Scotia
Registered: 2012-05-01
Posts: 214
Website

Re: How to get Beltza

Personally I am going to experiment with a lovely upright, long tailed Black Australorp cockerel that I got from Hollowridge. I'll put Him over some of my off-color layer girls from the eo hatches this winter and select for black with orange shanks. Then I'll cross back to an eo roo and hatch a bunch and select again for black/yellow.

This is at least a 7 generation project if I'm outcrossing to get black. True black Is absent in our EOs, so I'm going to experiment. If it all goes to pot at least ill have some colourful and friendly layers. What do you guys think?


No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man.
~Heraclitus

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#9 2013-04-14 00:51:51

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Re: How to get Beltza

Pay attention to chick down color as you select riverbend, you need to select for the Australorp EE based allele that causes the penguine like chicks to do justice to the black. And for non barring of course. Too bad you don't have any gorria EOs, it would be better to back cross to the non barred. I look forward to seeing your progress.


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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#10 2013-04-14 01:00:05

hollowridge
Member
From: Lunenburg, County, Nova Scotia
Registered: 2013-03-25
Posts: 259

Re: How to get Beltza

riverbendfarm wrote:

Personally I am going to experiment with a lovely upright, long tailed Black Australorp cockerel that I got from Hollowridge. I'll put Him over some of my off-color layer girls from the eo hatches this winter and select for black with orange shanks. Then I'll cross back to an eo roo and hatch a bunch and select again for black/yellow.

This is at least a 7 generation project if I'm outcrossing to get black. True black Is absent in our EOs, so I'm going to experiment. If it all goes to pot at least ill have some colourful and friendly layers. What do you guys think?

How did things go with the transition?  Has he settled in yet?  Sorry separation issues.  :nervous: We have had him in our thoughts since shipping him out.  Know he will do better with some girls of his own.  One rooster has made out coop much quieter; hardly know we have chickens except when the treat door opens.  ;)

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#11 2013-04-14 02:18:44

Micah and Kiah
Member
From: West Grey
Registered: 2012-04-20
Posts: 839

Re: How to get Beltza

RBF, I'd be happy to ship you Gorria eggs  :whistle:

poplar girl wrote:

Pay attention to chick down color as you select riverbend, you need to select for the Australorp EE based allele that causes the penguine like chicks to do justice to the black. And for non barring of course. Too bad you don't have any gorria EOs, it would be better to back cross to the non barred. I look forward to seeing your progress.


All the best,

Kiah and Micah

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#12 2013-04-15 00:58:24

riverbendfarm
Member
From: Baker Settlement, Nova Scotia
Registered: 2012-05-01
Posts: 214
Website

Re: How to get Beltza

Hollowridge he has settled in just perfectly. I gave him 2 Pendesenca pullets and he is as sweet as honey to them. :love: He clucks and calls them over for treats and they perch to either side of him in their big pen. He has such a gentle disposition compared to my Pendesenca roos! He eats treats from our hands and comes up to us for visits. I dearly hope that he passes that trait on to his offspring. I am trying him first with the pennies because he is most like them and I am needing an unrelated rooster very badly for these girls. His black shanks should pass on nicely to the offspring and I shall have to select for white earlobes whenever possible. I will likely give him some of my off-color EOs when they come into lay and hatch from them next season. In those crosses I shall have to select for Orange shanks and beak...that may be tougher. My daughter is in love with him and we have named him "Handsome" because he is such a suave fellow! I think I shall include your photos of him for the others to see.

http://i1269.photobucket.com/albums/jj587/riverbendfarmss/April72013020_zps66f16681.jpg

http://i1269.photobucket.com/albums/jj587/riverbendfarmss/April72013025_zpsae56208d.jpg

http://i1269.photobucket.com/albums/jj587/riverbendfarmss/April72013047_zps4c6c3093.jpg

http://i1269.photobucket.com/albums/jj587/riverbendfarmss/April72013051_zps00496adc.jpg

http://i1269.photobucket.com/albums/jj587/riverbendfarmss/April72013053_zps48ac0013.jpg

http://i1269.photobucket.com/albums/jj587/riverbendfarmss/April72013055_zpsc35968ea.jpg

Last edited by riverbendfarm (2013-04-15 00:59:57)


No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man.
~Heraclitus

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#13 2013-04-15 01:47:48

yardbirds
Member
From: just north of Yorkton, Sk.
Registered: 2012-07-09
Posts: 334

Re: How to get Beltza

:congrats:  Nice roo... sent you a pm


urban flock consisting two EOs thx Prairie Chick, one True Blue Ameraucana, and two Welsummers, thx Dan Smith and a gorgeous Easter Egger Hen, thx Flicker Chick. and 2 GLW pullets, 1 GLW cockerel, 1 SLW cockerel, 1 true blue Ameraucana pullet, and 4 EE pullets and 1 Cream Brabanter pullet, Thx to FRF, Anneke, and Fallyn.

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#14 2013-04-15 03:43:07

Micah and Kiah
Member
From: West Grey
Registered: 2012-04-20
Posts: 839

Re: How to get Beltza

Yowza  :love:


All the best,

Kiah and Micah

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#15 2013-04-15 11:46:42

hollowridge
Member
From: Lunenburg, County, Nova Scotia
Registered: 2013-03-25
Posts: 259

Re: How to get Beltza

Oh you have made us so happy Riverbend, great news!! :thumbsup: Whistle when you are coming for treats he will come right over :whistle:.  Tell your daughter who by the way is going to make a very lovely chicken breeder that he loves bell pepper seeds and sunflower seeds; black oil favorite. He will take them one by one out of your fingers. 

Thanks you made our day!!:excited:

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#16 2013-04-15 15:45:10

riverbendfarm
Member
From: Baker Settlement, Nova Scotia
Registered: 2012-05-01
Posts: 214
Website

Re: How to get Beltza

I'd love to try some Gloria's Micah and Kiah but I'm running sort of space!


No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man.
~Heraclitus

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#17 2013-04-15 16:03:31

Micah and Kiah
Member
From: West Grey
Registered: 2012-04-20
Posts: 839

Re: How to get Beltza

A few baby chicks of Mille Fleur and Gorria wouldn't take much space...  :whistle:


riverbendfarm wrote:

I'd love to try some Gloria's Micah and Kiah but I'm running sort of space!


All the best,

Kiah and Micah

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#18 2013-04-15 19:22:44

Little Boy Blue
Member
From: Marble Falls, Texas
Registered: 2012-07-11
Posts: 83
Website

Re: How to get Beltza

poplar girl wrote:

As much as I am not completely clueless in genetics I am having trouble figuring out how (or if) i can work towards the beltza variety of EO.

I know the beltza variety has an Extended black e-allele instead of wheaten which may be missing in our North American EO population. I also know it is unbarred, I have unbarred (gorria) EOs I can remove the barring with. But how to get to black and remove the gold and red?

Here is a rooster I gave to a friend last fall. I have purposed the idea to her of trying to use him to breed for beltza using some of the grey marraduna and/or gorria hens.

I played in the online chicken color calculator this morning and I can't replicate his color pattern. I do have a Genetics of Chicken Colour book yet to review but I thought I'd post some pictures and see if anyone has ideas.

http://i905.photobucket.com/albums/ac25 … 40e467.jpg

What do you think? Does he have potential for a breeder for beltza? I don't recall any chicks with really strange chick down color last spring so I think I would still need to outcross with a black breed. If so how would I get there?

Perhaps that's a bigger project than I'm willing to take on right now but it would be nice to know how it could be done.

The EO' cockerel at the beginning of this thread looks to have the resessive "charcoal"  gene that produces the brassy back coloring found in Game Fowl. It turnes gold plumage black. The gold bay feathers on the wing indicated that this is a gold based birds.  For black varrieties silver based birds are prefered because a gold base can create a green sheen.  The chestnut on the sholders and breast indicate that red enhancers are also in the birds.   The charcoal gene in a very intresteding find.


Cottage Hill Black Copper Marans & Cream Legbars

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#19 2013-04-15 22:52:31

picis peeps
Member
From: saskatoon
Registered: 2012-07-16
Posts: 108

Re: How to get Beltza

I am always impressed by the wealth of knowlege on this forum.  You guys (and gals) are just amazing.

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