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#1 2011-07-31 13:39:28

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

Some of the links give a pretty good description of the proper EO type, shank color, comb etc. But they seem to indicate that the color of a marraduna is like a gorria but with white bars. I don't think my marraduna look much like a gorria with white bars at all!

So what plumage color and pattern are they supposed to have? How much black and grey on the hens and roosters? Most of the photos I have seen the birds have flaws even I can now see, for example:
http://i905.photobucket.com/albums/ac252/sulzmi/a806fe88.png
To point out a couple flaws for the birds in this particular photo the rooster has white in his tail and one of the hens has willow (green) legs.


So how do we know what color of these birds is good (to the standard of perfection)? Does anyone have a written description of the proper feather colors? Or photos they know are of high quality birds?

I am gonna be selecting who to keep soon. Just a handful (2 or 3 roosters, 6 to 8 hens) that I will be pair breeding next year to better understand their genetics. I would like to make as informed selections as possible.


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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2011-07-31 13:39:28

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#2 2011-07-31 16:41:06

lys
Member
From: Bilbao, Basque Country, Spain
Registered: 2011-07-01
Posts: 55
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

poplar girl wrote:

Some of the links give a pretty good description of the proper EO type, shank color, comb etc. But they seem to indicate that the color of a marraduna is like a gorria but with white bars. I don't think my marraduna look much like a gorria with white bars at all!

So what plumage color and pattern are they supposed to have? How much black and grey on the hens and roosters? Most of the photos I have seen the birds have flaws even I can now see, for example:
http://i905.photobucket.com/albums/ac25 … 06fe88.png
To point out a couple flaws for the birds in this particular photo the rooster has white in his tail and one of the hens has willow (green) legs.


So how do we know what color of these birds is good (to the standard of perfection)? Does anyone have a written description of the proper feather colors? Or photos they know are of high quality birds?

I am gonna be selecting who to keep soon. Just a handful (2 or 3 roosters, 6 to 8 hens) that I will be pair breeding next year to better understand their genetics. I would like to make as informed selections as possible.

Hi. All marraduna roosters have white bars in the tail.

The colour is important, but I think the type and conformation is more important. Don't forget it's a breed in serious danger to eliminate all animals with faults.

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#3 2011-07-31 16:42:36

lys
Member
From: Bilbao, Basque Country, Spain
Registered: 2011-07-01
Posts: 55
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

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#4 2011-07-31 19:01:02

skeffling lavender farm
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From: Wiarton, ON, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-17
Posts: 2720
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

Hi. All marraduna roosters have white bars in the tail.

The colour is important, but I think the type and conformation is more important. Don't forget it's a breed in serious danger to eliminate all animals with faults.

Good points Lys.  I guess we just don't want to mess it up as these birds are so awesome!  :lol:  I am so glad I managed to share so many this year as it takes the responsibility down a little!   Those legs look three shades of yellow, but the hens legs can fade with egg laying too and pigment loss.  Nice link,  love the photos of those birds.  Poplar do you have the google toolbar?  Mine automatically translated that for me!

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#5 2011-08-01 06:05:24

poplar girl
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From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

Yes, I used google translate on the link. I have to cut and past it into my search and then when it finds the page I can select Translate.

Lys, I have about 20 roosters so I can't keep them all. I would like to try to find homes for the best of them though. Temperment and type are very important and will be considered first but I would like to understand color better.

I will post some pictures of my older roosters for opinions, maybe that will be the easiest way.


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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#6 2011-09-03 02:13:26

3riverschick
Member
From: Ligonier, in Pennsylvania, USA
Registered: 2011-08-11
Posts: 64
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

poplar girl wrote:

Some of the links give a pretty good description of the proper EO type, shank color, comb etc. But they seem to indicate that the color of a marraduna is like a gorria but with white bars. I don't think my marraduna look much like a gorria with white bars at all! .

==============================
I agree. I keep looking at Marraduna and seeing a barred Black-Tailed Buff. As I read it, Gorria is Black-Tailed Red (like the New Hampshire). 
I'm sadly confused, :banginghead:

Last edited by 3riverschick (2011-09-03 02:15:48)


Karen Tewart
"The present is best served when we remember the past."

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#7 2011-09-03 02:55:07

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

I think that maybe something has been lost in translation 3riverchick. Our eyes can't lie to us...marraduna hens are not red, they are more buff as you stated.


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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#8 2011-09-03 06:10:55

Skylinepoultry
Member
From: Old Fort, Tennessee
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 222
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

3riverschick wrote:

poplar girl wrote:

Some of the links give a pretty good description of the proper EO type, shank color, comb etc. But they seem to indicate that the color of a marraduna is like a gorria but with white bars. I don't think my marraduna look much like a gorria with white bars at all! .

==============================
I agree. I keep looking at Marraduna and seeing a barred Black-Tailed Buff. As I read it, Gorria is Black-Tailed Red (like the New Hampshire). 
I'm sadly confused, :banginghead:

Its challenging, isn't it?  Love it. More mystery. We'll figure it out. Let's just keep at it.
Lys, we need more people to join that know about Eukal Oiloak. Have you told anyone over there about dedicated people in North America wanting to preserve this breed?

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#9 2011-09-03 06:15:03

Skylinepoultry
Member
From: Old Fort, Tennessee
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 222
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

The thing that's been pondering my mind is this. Have these birds been crossed with anything else from here? I'm wanting to say yes but cant prove it. That's why I can't stress the fact of mass hatching because somethings gotta pop out.

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#10 2011-09-03 19:28:36

3riverschick
Member
From: Ligonier, in Pennsylvania, USA
Registered: 2011-08-11
Posts: 64
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

Hi,
Take a look at this:

http://demijohn.tripod.com/id9.html
The Golden Cuckoo Marans. I'm just referring to the amount of gold on this eWh based Golden Cuckoo ( GCM are supposed to be based on e+ wildtype).  Ok, forgetting the fact this is a Marans not an EO, ...that cuckoo does not visually manifest the same as classic barring(despite what the website owner says).
    The amount hue, and distribution of the gold and "barring" on the birds reminds me of Marraduna. The owner got this hue and distribution from some regular colored Golden Cuckoo he got from another American breeder of good repute. All the exclusions aside, the parallel I am trying to draw is that the Marranduna EO's in Basque seem to be a lot more like these GCM in color, hue and "barring" then what  we have here in North America. But if this Marans breeder can get the lighter, hue and distribution from a color 'sport' plus continued breeding for what he ended up with, ...then we should be able to do the same thing with our Marrraduna to get them to look like the ones in Basque.  This is a post with a very narrow point of view. If ya'll read too much into it, it won't make sense. I hope I am making sense.
Best,
Karen Tewart              :EO:

Last edited by 3riverschick (2011-09-03 19:31:17)


Karen Tewart
"The present is best served when we remember the past."

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#11 2011-09-04 00:15:49

ipf
Member
From: Salt Spring Island, BC, Canada
Registered: 2011-08-29
Posts: 168

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

The term "sport" generally means a mutation; mutations are unpredictable. Sometimes people call something a "sport" that is just a chance pairing of identical recessive alleles - almost impossible to know which without a lot of experimental matings.
One thing I think I see right away is that these bird have white (well, pink, but you know what I mean; not yellow) legs.

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#12 2011-09-04 00:57:40

poplar girl
Administrator
From: Athabasca, AB, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 3159

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

No columbian gene either. But the color does have similarities to the marraduna EO.


Raising red cuckoo (marraduna) Euskal Oiloak and self blue (lavender) & black Belgian Bearded d'Uccles.

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#13 2011-09-04 05:44:01

Skylinepoultry
Member
From: Old Fort, Tennessee
Registered: 2011-06-30
Posts: 222
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

ipf wrote:

The term "sport" generally means a mutation; mutations are unpredictable. Sometimes people call something a "sport" that is just a chance pairing of identical recessive alleles - almost impossible to know which without a lot of experimental matings.
One thing I think I see right away is that these bird have white (well, pink, but you know what I mean; not yellow) legs.

Makes me sad to know that birds Like New Hampshires and others that came from sports will eventually be wiped out due to improper breeding. You can't get them back. I believe the Delaware came from a sport too. Don't quote me on that though. We need a reference post on here referring to the definitions of genetic terms so people can revert back to it to make sense of what's being talked about. Exp: Autosomal, e-allele, sex linked, homozygous,& heterozygous. I believe that would be helpful.
Basically kind of like the word of day type thing. Sound like a good idea? Or better yet the post could be a word and the definition and then people could post from there strictly about that specific word.
Claire, could you add a topic for genetics in the index?

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#14 2011-09-04 13:08:17

skeffling lavender farm
Administrator
From: Wiarton, ON, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-17
Posts: 2720
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

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#15 2012-05-29 21:06:57

Terra-Blue
Member
From: Nashville, TN
Registered: 2012-04-27
Posts: 66
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

I was reading through this old topic, and was intrigued by it since I have been so interested in the colors.  It has seemed to me when I have found photos of EO in Spain / France that the hens are a very different color that what we have here.  The first post in this thread being another example.

Moslty the rest of my comments will be about hens...

When I look at that photo I can see the white barring.  It also seems that most of those birds are darker red.  Not as red as the Gorria, but darker than what we have.  While completely understanding the concept of building the barn first, and that color is not the primary consideration, it does seem possible to lose colors especially in a small inbred population.  Does anyone have a photo of a hen here that seems to have outstanding color?


Joni Johnson
Terra-Blue Pyrenean Shepherds
www.terra-blue.net

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#16 2012-05-30 02:51:29

skeffling lavender farm
Administrator
From: Wiarton, ON, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-17
Posts: 2720
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

Here are some of my pullets from last year.  They are quite dark golden there.  2 are more millie with the white on the heads and I bet after their first molt in the fall they'll get black spots on some of the feather ends like the mothers did. 

http://i949.photobucket.com/albums/ad340/skefflinglavenderfarm/Breedingpens2012058.jpg

This is the best IMO, she is the biggest too, grew fast

http://i949.photobucket.com/albums/ad340/skefflinglavenderfarm/IMG_9021.jpg

18 month to 2 year old moms after fading and molt

http://i949.photobucket.com/albums/ad340/skefflinglavenderfarm/Breedingpens2012014.jpg

One of them in her first year before fading and molt, she's the one on the right above!

http://i949.photobucket.com/albums/ad340/skefflinglavenderfarm/Dec2010052.jpg

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#17 2012-05-30 13:59:09

Terra-Blue
Member
From: Nashville, TN
Registered: 2012-04-27
Posts: 66
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

Thank you so much fort he photos.  Your girls are lovely!


Joni Johnson
Terra-Blue Pyrenean Shepherds
www.terra-blue.net

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#18 2012-05-31 02:29:52

skeffling lavender farm
Administrator
From: Wiarton, ON, Canada
Registered: 2011-06-17
Posts: 2720
Website

Re: Proper feather color of marraduna EOs?

Thanks, they look sweet but and all quite, quite greedy, 2 of the young ones jump for food! :whistle:

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